(Also, I wanted there to be 69 comments.)

Well, you certainly make arguments that are more than “God says this and so that’s the way it is.” But I don’t know if theologically neutral would be the appropriate way to describe it. I think what Chris was trying to say is that everything comes back to God’s word in the end for you. Right? I mean, that’s what I get from reading your blog as a whole. Arguments and viewpoints must be based on God’s law, or use God’s law as a jumping-off point.

If you think innocent human life is valuable, then you should be against abortion. If you don’t think it is all that valuable, then we could have a discussion on that.

I think that is waaaay too simplistic of a statement. Especially since you were just saying how the issue is too complex to just lay down simple truisms or blanket statements and be done with it. It’s not a matter of black and white, either/or. I am in favor of abortion remaining a legal option. Does that mean I do not value human life? If you think that’s what it means, then I don’t know what to say. But I certainly do value human life.

Is this subject a matter of internal debate among pro-lifers? That sometimes it would be ok to end a life? If so I had no idea.

I really do think that human life is very valuable. For some reason I can’t get myself to apply that to a fetus. Even if it is human life. Hm.

I’m trying hard to write my thoughts. I think I need to hear more about this before saying more. Now I’m going to use the “it’s late, I’m tired” excuse and duck out. ;)

Furthermore, do you really think that my arguments against abortion have been little more than bald appeals to “God’s law, like it or not”? If this is how they come across, I’d like to know. Because I feel that I did a decent job of arguing on more “theologically neutral” premises. If you think innocent human life is valuable, then you should be against abortion. If you don’t think it is all that valuable, then we could have a discussion on that. And, in that discussion, I don’t think I would just say “You know, Chris, God already laid down the law here and that’s that.” I do believe that God has “laid down the law,” but I also believe that He has given His people the responsibility of persuading others of the truth in love. God, as I understand His revelation on this matter, is okay with me arguing the value of human life without simply saying “God says I’m right, so get with the program.”

I don’t believe that there any ‘exceptions’ to God’s law, but I do believe that His law is more “situation-based” than you might expect. IOW, I don’t envision God’s las as being some sort of list of simple rules. I think that the Law is summed up in the 10 Commandments (and even more powerfully and succinctly in the “two greatest commandments”–love God with all your heart, soul, and mind and love your neighbor as yourself), but that the rest of Scripture “fills out” what those commandments mean. The 6th commandment, for instance, says that we ought not kill, but reading the rest of Scripture makes it clear that this is no an “absolute” prohibition against any and all killing.

He’s already laid down the law and that’s that. I don’t operate under those conditions so I feel I’m free to think otherwise. I think that you think everyone operates under God’s law whether we like it or not. We’ll face judgement one day for it. I don’t see it that way. I think this is the ultimate divider and the reason the abortion issue will never be settled.

I don’t really see how this is the issue in the debate over abortion. I mean, you’re correct concerning my belief that God’s law applies to all whether they like it or not, but how does this settle the abortion debate? Philosophically, you could agree with me about God and about there being some universal law that He wants all people to obey–but then disagree with me that abortion is forbidden by that law. We could both be “God’s law” advocates, but disagree as to what the law is.

But thanks for the advice about caching. That sounds promising, and I’ll see if it works when I get home on Sunday evening.

(Meant to put this in the last comment but I accidentally hit Return and poof! the comment was gone.)

So anyway Xon, if you right-click in the comment window there should be a “reload” or “refresh” option. Try that. First, empty your cache, though.

And as for losing long comments, having learned the hard way, I now usually write anything of substantial length in TextEdit and save it frequently, then copy and paste it in.

Xon, the only thing I can figure is that you must have a cached version. Maybe it is not automatically updating with the newest comment when the page refreshes after you hit ‘post comment’.

Well, in this particular debate perhaps.

According to your line of thinking I am placing a greater value on the life of born human beings. Call it what you will. We can call it “old enough that you gain protection under the law”. We already put a higher value on living persons today. Can’t vote til you’re 18. Can’t invade a country unless you’re an American… Personally I’d consider someone unmurderable somewhere in the 2nd or 3rd trimester.

But I’ve already lost you. You have an ultimate lawmaker that doesn’t make exceptions. He’s already laid down the law and that’s that. I don’t operate under those conditions so I feel I’m free to think otherwise. I think that you think everyone operates under God’s law whether we like it or not. We’ll face judgement one day for it. I don’t see it that way. I think this is the ultimate divider and the reason the abortion issue will never be settled.